I'm for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rare_Earth_hypothesis, so I think aliens probably exist somewhere in the universe, but probably very far away from Solar system, and visits are unlikely (but not impossible).
Me too. Do you know what the Drake equation is? It's a formula for estimating the frequency of alien life. It's just a multiplicative formula. I think the standard terms are a little generous. You can add more terms to address more factors if you want to be more pessimistic. I did it once and got back about 1 instance of intelligent life per galaxy. But it could easily be off by a factor of 1000 in either direction, or more.
We only have a sample population 1 for genesis events. And because it's a given that we would only be aware of life where life is, the fact that we are aware of life on Earth is a biased sample. So really we have a sample population of 0 to go off of.
Are there flying objects that observers are unable to identify? Absolutely. And many remain unidentified. The nature of what they are is wide open for debate, though most are probably nothing exciting if you knew what they were.
Is there extraterrestrial life? I think it would be impossible for there not to be.
Is there extraterrestrial complex (multi-cellular) life? Given the size of the universe, again, it is all but impossible for there not to be.
Is there extraterrestrial intelligent life? This is the real question. Implicit in it, for most people, is the addendum "at the same time as us?" And that is complicated by "what does 'at the same time' mean in a universe where enough distance essentially makes two locations islands of time, unable to communicate in an immediate, meaningful way?"
So to answer each part of the implicit actual question:
Has there been intelligent life prior to us? Maybe.
Is there intelligent life at the same time as us, whatever that timeframe might mean? A very weak maybe, if we include the notion that such contemporaneous existence was both knowable to us and might have some effect on us. (The two maybes leave open the possibility that we are the First Ones in the universe.)
Will there be intelligent life elsewhere in the universe between now and the end of existence? Once again I invoke the sheer magnitude of the universe. There almost must be. Whether we ever know it, or they ever know about us, is another thing entirely. But simple existence? All but impossible for there not to be.
Here's a thinker. If there is an infinite universe and almost all possible arrangements of atoms exist somewhere; Is it possible that a stable intelligent system was created exclusively by initial arrangement, at or near the big bang? And that as a system would not only be as smart as you, but smarter? Given an infinite universe it has to be a guarantee.
That's pretty close to what Frank Tipler predicted for the end of our universe in The Physics of Immortality.
Vaguely related, there was a mind-blowing talk, I think to The Royal Society, that I watched on Youtube over a year ago. It was on the physics and mathematics of black holes and singularities, and the part that blew my mind was, if you work out what the... I think it was mass density... range would be inside of a singularity, then the universe we are in falls inside that range. I.e., we could theoretically be inside somebody else's black hole. I'll see if I can find it again and share it here, it was a brain-bender.
Yep. There is a property of blackholes, or really space, that it can only contain as much information as the surface of an arbitrary sphere around it. In theory an event horizon forms where that limit is hit. If both information and mass are roughly proportional to volume, and the surface area of a sphere is proportional to r^2; Then considering a sufficiently large r will violate that law at some point.
I have a theory that uses that as driver for space expansion. As the largest considerable r increases, on account of the observable universe expanding from there being more time to observe it, the only way to balance the law is for information density to go down. You can't destroy information. Conservation of information is a thing. So if information density needs to go down over the scale of the observable universe, then space has to expand.
I've never heard any authoritative source share that idea, but I don't see another way to balance the logic. And it gives us a result for something we've seen where I don't like any of the other explanations.
Yep. Except stable and infinitely smarter. God should physically exist in an infinite universe. The FTL question becomes pretty relevant in two ways. If any kind of FTL process can happen then it has two consequences that wouldn't exist otherwise.
It decides if this God point in space could interact, or if timescales of round trip communication would block. And light speed limits the scale of the observable universe. If there are obscure ways to do FTL then the scale of the universe worth considering goes up by infinity and it becomes a guarantee.
So if FTL then God becomes a logical outcome. If not FTL, then there would be a God level intelligence somewhere out there, but you might not be able to interact with it. But if FTL, then this God level intelligence would have it.
I've got a theory that Black holes are giant AI super computers. Or maybe an alien form of life that is foreign to our understanding. Notice how you need matter, atoms, molecules etc, to build a computer. A data center needs even more. If we built a Dyson sphere around our sun, that's block out all light to those observing it yet it'd still have the pull of gravity. And why would we want to build that anyway? To power a giant super computer . To calculate what? I don't know, problems I can't even conceive of. What is the black hole at the center of our galaxy? Maybe a giant supercomputer, and it is slowly sucking all the stars, planets, everything in the galaxy, into itself, where inside the black hole it is calculating complex problems.
Maybe it can't go any faster than the speed of light, and it'll take trillions of years to finish absorbing the entire universe, but that's just a different timescale than our human brains can comprehend. And you could call this all a god.
also why would the size of the universe mean there must be intelligent life? sure there could be a chance of intelligent life but is that really a proof? God created earth and he didn't mention any aliens.
why would the size of the universe mean there must be intelligent life?
Because the size of the universe is pretty literally incomprehensible, certainly without the tools of mathematics and science, and yet here, in the backwater portion of the unfashionable arm of one single galaxy in a universe containing billions of galaxies, not only did life happen, but it rose to sentience. With billions of galaxies containing billions upon billions of solar systems, across a span of time of billions of years, to say that the thing could only happen once is risible. If it happened once, it can happen again, and there are, insofar as human comprehension is concerned, near infinite opportunities for it to have happened before, and to happen again. Even if you set the probability infinitesimally low, that the chance of life rising to intelligence is a 1×10−1000000000000000000000000000 chance of happening, then in a universe the size of ours, that still means "more than once".
But if you believe a book written thousands of years ago by sheepherders, even if you accept that they were divinely inspired, means that doing science is pointless because the book is everything and reality is nothing, congratulations, you are the reason people see religion as backward and stagnant. If God exists, you have no idea what He has said or thought. All you know is what people with less chance of knowledge than you were able to interpret from what He may or may not have revealed to them.
you should burn in the fires of the hell since you worship the devil openly. Your own actions are proof of that, you are part of satanic cult and show zero respect to other people. False christian clearly.
okay now you jumped to conclusions which I never supported, good for you. Keep on lying and making nonsensical points. Did you forget that big bang theory was made by a christian scientist? If i can't believe in sciences because of bible then you can't believe in big bang because the scientist was christian who believed in the bible. Seems fair.
Oh really, this guy forgot that God created the universe and he is bigger than universe. Size of it is not proof of aliens, if you knew physics you'd know how unlikely it is that there is life on earth. The exact position and the tilt etc. are important. Otherwise it'd be too cold or hot for life. I think you are clearly a science denialist, you say aliens must exist due to lack of proof of them.
your reading comprehension is also straight up terrible, all my points only apply if you agree on the first premise yet you insist on pushing your satanic worldview by force. It's full of lies and you are full of shit.
Jesus told us to evangelize all the people on earth, if sentient aliens existed why would he exclude them? That'd mean they'd be destined to hell since you can't save yourself. Also humans were created as an image of God, what would alien then be? God said humans were perfect, if aliens are not mentioned were they imperfect creations then? but God doesn't create anything imperfect. From secular view i can understand why people think aliens are real but i just don't think it's compatible with Christianity if you know the Bible.
If aliens existed then they would also have to repent to reach the heaven if they were sentient beings. I just don't see how this is compatible with christianity. It'd make no sense that God didn't mention other species he created.
heavens is not same as the outer space as far as im concerned. actually some interpret the heaven just as a state of mind and not physical place, so there is debate to what it actually is.
If heaven is just a state of mind, then why are there specific kinds of creatures there? If God's throne is in heaven, and heaven is just a state of mind, then God exists only in the mind? When Jesus was baptized, and the Spirit appeared in the form of a dove, and a voice from heaven (state of mind) said "This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased," this voice came from a state of mind?
When Jesus said after his resurrection, "And I have other sheep that are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd." Who was he referring to if not aliens?
I think kraken is referring to gnostics? They had a lot of gospels saying just that, it's all in your head. But kraken should deny that if he also believes the regular Bible.
I DID NOT SAY THAT WAS THE RIGHT INTERPRETATION, how difficult is reading comprehension for you?? seriously. I am not referring to gnostics. Whatever, this discussion is clearly a waste of time since people here have seriously lack of knowledge about the holy Bible and it's full of trolls. No serious biblical scholar would suggest that aliens existed now or ever. Also many christians NOT gnostics do believe that heaven is a state of mind, it's a different discussion whether that is actually correct or not.
Why'd ya bring it up if you think it's false? I think you might be having a crisis of faith right here lol.
This thread is about aliens, so we have theories, but have to admit we don't have proof.
If religion is all just symbolism then less people will be interested in it, it won't make money for priests, that's why gnostics were persecuted and their books burned.
Faith is believing something with no proof, that's the most retarded thing you could do.
I did not say that's the correct interpretation however it's a popular one. I do think it's little bit strange if heaven is not a physical place. The other sheep are obviously those who have turned to Jesus despite not having full access to the whole Bible. People outside of the church who find Jesus. I think it's very loose argument to say that the other sheep would be aliens. I think Jesus is here referring to for eg. tribes which maybe somehow get hold of the Bible. You wouldn't expect someone who doesn't go to a church to be saved but that can happen if the person gets a single page of Bible.
again, why would Jesus not mention these other creatures in the genesis? You can NOT be saved without Jesus and it's almost impossible to know about Jesus if someone doesn't give you the bible or get evangelized. Knowing God is not enough to be saved, Jesus should've then by any logic said in the NT that space must be conquered and aliens need to be evangelized as well.
there are many "other sheep" who in this life lived unholy life. The unlikely people can be saved through the grace. Some of the nazis in their deathbed regretted what they've done. Again example of unlikely person to be saved which has nothing to do with aliens. The whole alien talk is because secularism affects christian culture. The disciplines thought Jesus was a ghost, remember? that was all deception and lies. Just like aliens, they can distract you from what's most important. What Jesus did in the cross. In reality there are evil spirits and im 100% certain that people who believe in ghost and UFO stuff are being deceived by the devil. It's a slippery slope to occultism. Look into cults, so many of them claim aliens and UFOS are real. Yet they do horrible things. If you believe in aliens then you might say ghost exist and go ghost hunting. Doesn't take much from there that person goes further into occultism. It can happen for some people.
notice how Jesus said the other sheep, not for eg. the other goat or some other species. The sheep Jesus is referring to are clearly the humans, us. Otherwise it would make sense he'd make it clear that the other sheep were completely different species. During our life on earth we belong to different churches but one day we will unite as childs of God.
Those writing the Bible thought there was a firmament and a dome and the stars are windows that open up and let rain water out. That was a legitimate scientific theory based on the evidence they had at the time.
first of all, i was arguing from christian perspective. If you reject christianity then it doesn't really matter. Secondly that's just wrong, the Bible hints earth being round: isaiah 40:22, job 26:7 (sounds like the earth is on space like it really is). The apostles who wrote the NT most likely knew earth being round since the greek had already figured it out at the time. And the those OT references hint that the earth could be round. It's actually a myth that people in the middle ages or earlier thought earth was flat, only a small minority believed that. Also the Apostles were not dumb, Luke was a doctor. There is no reason to think they were flat earthers and no evidence to support such claims. Just because minority believed in misinformation doesn't mean they all did. It's the same now: some people make unscientific claims and call it "science" yet they are usually in the minority.
back to my first point then: if you are a christian and believe the Bible is word of God, believing in extraterrestrial life makes no sense. If not then you can believe what you want. According to christianity bible was written people who were inspired by the holy spirit. So if they thought earth was not round the why would they write those verses hinting that'd be the case? Bible was written only 30-50 years after Jesus died which is not that long considering they told the same stories by mouth. 30 years is imo quite short time for something many consider "inaccurate".
Well it's not the word of god lol that's childish nonsense most grow out of like Santa. so that's irrelevant. It's good that you believe that though because it will hopefully lead you to an ethical life. You're afraid god is reading your mind right now. Just don't give any money to churches ok?
Happily, your opinions are not mandates for anybody but you. And if you want to persuade others that your opinions should have any weight, you should probably put down the bible and pick up a book on logic, and another on rhetoric.
He said earlier here that Jesus commanded Christians to evangelize. He didn't but kraken (interesting satanic name) is trying to do that on .... goat matrix?
An atheist would be like someone saying aliens don't exist. What's the proof? An agnostic is just not sure. To prove aliens don't exist you'd need to somehow search every planet in the universe. We can prove the Christian god doesn't exist but that still wouldn't prove no god at all exists.
Yes. UFOS do exist but they are a psyop from the government to convince people of the Alien Hoax. Time and time again Alien events were exposed as government psyops, this is because they are going to set up a massive Alien hoax to fool people into following their ideas.
I haven't shared my theory on alien abductions in this thread. I think some of the abductions were real. But they were a CIA human experimentation op, not unlike MK Ultra. The reported abductions do seem to align with the cold war, and petered out after the cold war ended. I think some of the reported abductions are genuine lying or delusion, and so a few reported abductions continued after the end of the cold war as a result of cultural momentum.
The Alien Hoax and NASA hoax are a very sophisticated psyop and very old. I do believe some abduction stories are true but the government simply druged people and made use of mutants in order to fool their víctims. I think the grey aliens were mutants that the government created, the same thing goes with other rare appearances, like the Mothman. I think these were all high-level MK-ULTRA-like government psyops with mutants. I will cover it up the best I can once I have free time but damn life can get complicated...
There's a theory that the 1947 Roswell crash was a plan by Joseph Stalin, he had the nazi josef mengele captured and made him continue his experiments on kids. He made some modified to look like grey aliens and that's who were the alien pilots captured from the Roswell crash.
Log in
I'm for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rare_Earth_hypothesis, so I think aliens probably exist somewhere in the universe, but probably very far away from Solar system, and visits are unlikely (but not impossible).
(voted for "I'm alien agnostic")
Me too. Do you know what the Drake equation is? It's a formula for estimating the frequency of alien life. It's just a multiplicative formula. I think the standard terms are a little generous. You can add more terms to address more factors if you want to be more pessimistic. I did it once and got back about 1 instance of intelligent life per galaxy. But it could easily be off by a factor of 1000 in either direction, or more.
We only have a sample population 1 for genesis events. And because it's a given that we would only be aware of life where life is, the fact that we are aware of life on Earth is a biased sample. So really we have a sample population of 0 to go off of.
Yeah, in fact there's a similar formula further in the Wiki article I linked:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rare_Earth_hypothesis#Rare_Earth_equation
UFO's and aliens are just a psyop to distract from the corruption in the gov
[x] UFOs and aliens are psyops.
I think the ancient gods and goddesses were space aliens who helped shape Earth civilizations and brought them their code of laws as a religion.
Would be awesome if they left some gates behind we could use to visit them. That would be dope.
I think the Great Pyramids of Egypt are machines to do just that. The afterlife was a stargate to an alien planet.
Are there flying objects that observers are unable to identify? Absolutely. And many remain unidentified. The nature of what they are is wide open for debate, though most are probably nothing exciting if you knew what they were.
Is there extraterrestrial life? I think it would be impossible for there not to be.
Is there extraterrestrial complex (multi-cellular) life? Given the size of the universe, again, it is all but impossible for there not to be.
Is there extraterrestrial intelligent life? This is the real question. Implicit in it, for most people, is the addendum "at the same time as us?" And that is complicated by "what does 'at the same time' mean in a universe where enough distance essentially makes two locations islands of time, unable to communicate in an immediate, meaningful way?"
So to answer each part of the implicit actual question:
Has there been intelligent life prior to us? Maybe.
Is there intelligent life at the same time as us, whatever that timeframe might mean? A very weak maybe, if we include the notion that such contemporaneous existence was both knowable to us and might have some effect on us. (The two maybes leave open the possibility that we are the First Ones in the universe.)
Will there be intelligent life elsewhere in the universe between now and the end of existence? Once again I invoke the sheer magnitude of the universe. There almost must be. Whether we ever know it, or they ever know about us, is another thing entirely. But simple existence? All but impossible for there not to be.
Here's a thinker. If there is an infinite universe and almost all possible arrangements of atoms exist somewhere; Is it possible that a stable intelligent system was created exclusively by initial arrangement, at or near the big bang? And that as a system would not only be as smart as you, but smarter? Given an infinite universe it has to be a guarantee.
That's pretty close to what Frank Tipler predicted for the end of our universe in The Physics of Immortality.
Vaguely related, there was a mind-blowing talk, I think to The Royal Society, that I watched on Youtube over a year ago. It was on the physics and mathematics of black holes and singularities, and the part that blew my mind was, if you work out what the... I think it was mass density... range would be inside of a singularity, then the universe we are in falls inside that range. I.e., we could theoretically be inside somebody else's black hole. I'll see if I can find it again and share it here, it was a brain-bender.
Yep. There is a property of blackholes, or really space, that it can only contain as much information as the surface of an arbitrary sphere around it. In theory an event horizon forms where that limit is hit. If both information and mass are roughly proportional to volume, and the surface area of a sphere is proportional to r^2; Then considering a sufficiently large r will violate that law at some point.
I have a theory that uses that as driver for space expansion. As the largest considerable r increases, on account of the observable universe expanding from there being more time to observe it, the only way to balance the law is for information density to go down. You can't destroy information. Conservation of information is a thing. So if information density needs to go down over the scale of the observable universe, then space has to expand.
I've never heard any authoritative source share that idea, but I don't see another way to balance the logic. And it gives us a result for something we've seen where I don't like any of the other explanations.
Like a Boltzmann brain randomly forming.
Yep. Except stable and infinitely smarter. God should physically exist in an infinite universe. The FTL question becomes pretty relevant in two ways. If any kind of FTL process can happen then it has two consequences that wouldn't exist otherwise.
It decides if this God point in space could interact, or if timescales of round trip communication would block. And light speed limits the scale of the observable universe. If there are obscure ways to do FTL then the scale of the universe worth considering goes up by infinity and it becomes a guarantee.
So if FTL then God becomes a logical outcome. If not FTL, then there would be a God level intelligence somewhere out there, but you might not be able to interact with it. But if FTL, then this God level intelligence would have it.
I've got a theory that Black holes are giant AI super computers. Or maybe an alien form of life that is foreign to our understanding. Notice how you need matter, atoms, molecules etc, to build a computer. A data center needs even more. If we built a Dyson sphere around our sun, that's block out all light to those observing it yet it'd still have the pull of gravity. And why would we want to build that anyway? To power a giant super computer . To calculate what? I don't know, problems I can't even conceive of. What is the black hole at the center of our galaxy? Maybe a giant supercomputer, and it is slowly sucking all the stars, planets, everything in the galaxy, into itself, where inside the black hole it is calculating complex problems.
Maybe it can't go any faster than the speed of light, and it'll take trillions of years to finish absorbing the entire universe, but that's just a different timescale than our human brains can comprehend. And you could call this all a god.
Just a theory, no proof.
also why would the size of the universe mean there must be intelligent life? sure there could be a chance of intelligent life but is that really a proof? God created earth and he didn't mention any aliens.
Because the size of the universe is pretty literally incomprehensible, certainly without the tools of mathematics and science, and yet here, in the backwater portion of the unfashionable arm of one single galaxy in a universe containing billions of galaxies, not only did life happen, but it rose to sentience. With billions of galaxies containing billions upon billions of solar systems, across a span of time of billions of years, to say that the thing could only happen once is risible. If it happened once, it can happen again, and there are, insofar as human comprehension is concerned, near infinite opportunities for it to have happened before, and to happen again. Even if you set the probability infinitesimally low, that the chance of life rising to intelligence is a 1×10−1000000000000000000000000000 chance of happening, then in a universe the size of ours, that still means "more than once".
But if you believe a book written thousands of years ago by sheepherders, even if you accept that they were divinely inspired, means that doing science is pointless because the book is everything and reality is nothing, congratulations, you are the reason people see religion as backward and stagnant. If God exists, you have no idea what He has said or thought. All you know is what people with less chance of knowledge than you were able to interpret from what He may or may not have revealed to them.
chakwit, I think you broke him.
you should burn in the fires of the hell since you worship the devil openly. Your own actions are proof of that, you are part of satanic cult and show zero respect to other people. False christian clearly.
Easy there chief.
okay now you jumped to conclusions which I never supported, good for you. Keep on lying and making nonsensical points. Did you forget that big bang theory was made by a christian scientist? If i can't believe in sciences because of bible then you can't believe in big bang because the scientist was christian who believed in the bible. Seems fair.
if reality is nothing then how come aliens are real? are you dumb perchance?
Oh really, this guy forgot that God created the universe and he is bigger than universe. Size of it is not proof of aliens, if you knew physics you'd know how unlikely it is that there is life on earth. The exact position and the tilt etc. are important. Otherwise it'd be too cold or hot for life. I think you are clearly a science denialist, you say aliens must exist due to lack of proof of them.
your reading comprehension is also straight up terrible, all my points only apply if you agree on the first premise yet you insist on pushing your satanic worldview by force. It's full of lies and you are full of shit.
He didn't mention magnets to you. 10 verses in genesis isn't going to cover everything.
Jesus told us to evangelize all the people on earth, if sentient aliens existed why would he exclude them? That'd mean they'd be destined to hell since you can't save yourself. Also humans were created as an image of God, what would alien then be? God said humans were perfect, if aliens are not mentioned were they imperfect creations then? but God doesn't create anything imperfect. From secular view i can understand why people think aliens are real but i just don't think it's compatible with Christianity if you know the Bible.
If aliens existed then they would also have to repent to reach the heaven if they were sentient beings. I just don't see how this is compatible with christianity. It'd make no sense that God didn't mention other species he created.
There is a lot of talk in the Bible tho about the heavens, and the angels that live there.
heavens is not same as the outer space as far as im concerned. actually some interpret the heaven just as a state of mind and not physical place, so there is debate to what it actually is.
If heaven is just a state of mind, then why are there specific kinds of creatures there? If God's throne is in heaven, and heaven is just a state of mind, then God exists only in the mind? When Jesus was baptized, and the Spirit appeared in the form of a dove, and a voice from heaven (state of mind) said "This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased," this voice came from a state of mind?
When Jesus said after his resurrection, "And I have other sheep that are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd." Who was he referring to if not aliens?
I think kraken is referring to gnostics? They had a lot of gospels saying just that, it's all in your head. But kraken should deny that if he also believes the regular Bible.
atheists thinking they know the bible better than christians, sigh
I DID NOT SAY THAT WAS THE RIGHT INTERPRETATION, how difficult is reading comprehension for you?? seriously. I am not referring to gnostics. Whatever, this discussion is clearly a waste of time since people here have seriously lack of knowledge about the holy Bible and it's full of trolls. No serious biblical scholar would suggest that aliens existed now or ever. Also many christians NOT gnostics do believe that heaven is a state of mind, it's a different discussion whether that is actually correct or not.
Why'd ya bring it up if you think it's false? I think you might be having a crisis of faith right here lol.
This thread is about aliens, so we have theories, but have to admit we don't have proof.
If religion is all just symbolism then less people will be interested in it, it won't make money for priests, that's why gnostics were persecuted and their books burned.
Faith is believing something with no proof, that's the most retarded thing you could do.
I did not say that's the correct interpretation however it's a popular one. I do think it's little bit strange if heaven is not a physical place. The other sheep are obviously those who have turned to Jesus despite not having full access to the whole Bible. People outside of the church who find Jesus. I think it's very loose argument to say that the other sheep would be aliens. I think Jesus is here referring to for eg. tribes which maybe somehow get hold of the Bible. You wouldn't expect someone who doesn't go to a church to be saved but that can happen if the person gets a single page of Bible.
again, why would Jesus not mention these other creatures in the genesis? You can NOT be saved without Jesus and it's almost impossible to know about Jesus if someone doesn't give you the bible or get evangelized. Knowing God is not enough to be saved, Jesus should've then by any logic said in the NT that space must be conquered and aliens need to be evangelized as well.
there are many "other sheep" who in this life lived unholy life. The unlikely people can be saved through the grace. Some of the nazis in their deathbed regretted what they've done. Again example of unlikely person to be saved which has nothing to do with aliens. The whole alien talk is because secularism affects christian culture. The disciplines thought Jesus was a ghost, remember? that was all deception and lies. Just like aliens, they can distract you from what's most important. What Jesus did in the cross. In reality there are evil spirits and im 100% certain that people who believe in ghost and UFO stuff are being deceived by the devil. It's a slippery slope to occultism. Look into cults, so many of them claim aliens and UFOS are real. Yet they do horrible things. If you believe in aliens then you might say ghost exist and go ghost hunting. Doesn't take much from there that person goes further into occultism. It can happen for some people.
notice how Jesus said the other sheep, not for eg. the other goat or some other species. The sheep Jesus is referring to are clearly the humans, us. Otherwise it would make sense he'd make it clear that the other sheep were completely different species. During our life on earth we belong to different churches but one day we will unite as childs of God.
Those writing the Bible thought there was a firmament and a dome and the stars are windows that open up and let rain water out. That was a legitimate scientific theory based on the evidence they had at the time.
first of all, i was arguing from christian perspective. If you reject christianity then it doesn't really matter. Secondly that's just wrong, the Bible hints earth being round: isaiah 40:22, job 26:7 (sounds like the earth is on space like it really is). The apostles who wrote the NT most likely knew earth being round since the greek had already figured it out at the time. And the those OT references hint that the earth could be round. It's actually a myth that people in the middle ages or earlier thought earth was flat, only a small minority believed that. Also the Apostles were not dumb, Luke was a doctor. There is no reason to think they were flat earthers and no evidence to support such claims. Just because minority believed in misinformation doesn't mean they all did. It's the same now: some people make unscientific claims and call it "science" yet they are usually in the minority.
I didn't say they thought it was flat but yeah they did also think that.
We could talk about Jesus. Not really the topic of this thread tho.
The Bible was written by men years after his death who never knew him. He was a rebel fighting the Romans.
back to my first point then: if you are a christian and believe the Bible is word of God, believing in extraterrestrial life makes no sense. If not then you can believe what you want. According to christianity bible was written people who were inspired by the holy spirit. So if they thought earth was not round the why would they write those verses hinting that'd be the case? Bible was written only 30-50 years after Jesus died which is not that long considering they told the same stories by mouth. 30 years is imo quite short time for something many consider "inaccurate".
Well it's not the word of god lol that's childish nonsense most grow out of like Santa. so that's irrelevant. It's good that you believe that though because it will hopefully lead you to an ethical life. You're afraid god is reading your mind right now. Just don't give any money to churches ok?
I don't do what atheists tell me to do, you are trying to control and manipulate me.
Stop replying then. I suspect you secretly agree with me.
There's intelligent life on this planet and there's so many other planets it just seems likely. But not proven. It's a theory.
I don't agree on extraterrestrial life tbh. I rather see epstein files without redactions than focus my energy on talkig about aliens.
Happily, your opinions are not mandates for anybody but you. And if you want to persuade others that your opinions should have any weight, you should probably put down the bible and pick up a book on logic, and another on rhetoric.
He said earlier here that Jesus commanded Christians to evangelize. He didn't but kraken (interesting satanic name) is trying to do that on .... goat matrix?
you are clearly satanic and mean, now screw off atheist
An atheist would be like someone saying aliens don't exist. What's the proof? An agnostic is just not sure. To prove aliens don't exist you'd need to somehow search every planet in the universe. We can prove the Christian god doesn't exist but that still wouldn't prove no god at all exists.
Watch mirage men
Yes. UFOS do exist but they are a psyop from the government to convince people of the Alien Hoax. Time and time again Alien events were exposed as government psyops, this is because they are going to set up a massive Alien hoax to fool people into following their ideas.
The Pentagon Disinformation That Fueled America’s UFO Mythology.
I haven't shared my theory on alien abductions in this thread. I think some of the abductions were real. But they were a CIA human experimentation op, not unlike MK Ultra. The reported abductions do seem to align with the cold war, and petered out after the cold war ended. I think some of the reported abductions are genuine lying or delusion, and so a few reported abductions continued after the end of the cold war as a result of cultural momentum.
The Alien Hoax and NASA hoax are a very sophisticated psyop and very old. I do believe some abduction stories are true but the government simply druged people and made use of mutants in order to fool their víctims. I think the grey aliens were mutants that the government created, the same thing goes with other rare appearances, like the Mothman. I think these were all high-level MK-ULTRA-like government psyops with mutants. I will cover it up the best I can once I have free time but damn life can get complicated...
There's a theory that the 1947 Roswell crash was a plan by Joseph Stalin, he had the nazi josef mengele captured and made him continue his experiments on kids. He made some modified to look like grey aliens and that's who were the alien pilots captured from the Roswell crash.
The situation is stranger than human brains can consider. They're more akin to an electromagnetic wave.